JMS on CompuServe (Jan 06, 1998) *POSSIBLE SPOILERS*

bbarrett at speedlink.com bbarrett at speedlink.com
Wed Jan 7 02:46:58 EST 1998


 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WARNING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 The following posts may contain SPOILERS for
 upcoming Babylon 5 episodes.

 Continue at your own risk.
 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 S
  P
   O
    I
     L
      E
       R

         P
          R
           O
            T
             E
              C
               T
                I
                 O
                  N
 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 THE FOLLOWING MATERIAL IS THE COPYRIGHT OF THE
 RESPECTIVE MESSAGE AUTHORS AND CANNOT BE 
 REPRODUCED IN ANY FORM WITHOUT THE EXPRESSED
 PERMISSION OF THE AUTHOR.  
 
 Note that JMS has expressed his public permission 
 that all of his messages may be reproduced freely.

 I give permission for my summaries to be reposted in
 any form, however I reserve all rights to them and
 the right to revoke this permission at any time.
 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  Archives of this material may be found at:

          http://www.johndelenn.com/
 **********************************************


 [ Summary of subjects in this section: ]
    Sb: #13301-#Claudia
    Sb: #13478-#Claudia
    Sb: #13108-#B5 Calendar
    Sb: #13302-#ItB and The Gathering
    Sb: #13442-<<ItB: Dilgar War ? >>
    Sb: #<TG> Zoo Scene
    Sb: #13469-#Marcus....why
    Sb: #13054-#In the Beginning
    Sb: #13513-#<<ItB - Zowie!>>
    Sb: #13250-<<ItB - Zowie!>>
    Sb: #13116-#<<In the Beginning>>
    Sb: #13315-<ITB> thoughts
    Sb: #13173-#<ITB> thoughts
    Sb: #13357-#<ITB> thoughts
    Sb: #13223-In the Beginning
    Sb: #13254-In the Beginning


 [ Summary: Asks if JMS was always prepared to replace Ivanova. ]

 #: 13422 S2/Bab 5: General
    05-Jan-98  23:48:03
Sb: #13301-#Claudia
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      Trap doors have always been in place for all the characters.

                                                                    jms

 [ Summary: "I'm looking forward to the new season and to the changes 
   made as well as what the HECK can happen to the main characters.  
   Assuming Sheridan and his wife will still be main characters?" ]

 #: 13522 S2/Bab 5: General
    06-Jan-98  15:47:10
Sb: #13478-#Claudia
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      Oh, Sheridan and Delenn will definitely be sticking around.

                                                                    jms

 [ Summary: "I notice on the B5 calendar my son kindly bought me for 
   Christmas, that the USA premier of Midnight on The Firing Line 
   was on 24th January 1944." ]

 #: 13421 S2/Bab 5: General
    05-Jan-98  23:48:03
Sb: #13108-#B5 Calendar
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

"By showing this on equipment obviously supplied from the future, mean that 
the time line was disturbed ?"

      Good grief, if that's true then I'm seriously out of phase, and at any 
second I could completely disappea


 #: 13302 S2/Bab 5: General
    05-Jan-98  19:06:06
Sb: ItB and The Gathering
Fm: SYSOP_DUPA_T_PARROT

Hot damn, Joe! Youse guys do good work! ItB was one heckuva ride.

It's such a shame that we'll have to wait a year to nominate ItB for the Hugo 
<g>. So, are ya planning to go to Australia in 1999?


The Gathering re-edit was also a treat. The restored scenes were worth it (and 
happily the "Muppets" were blown out of an airlock <g>). I noticed the scene 
where Delenn was carrying Garibaldi to safety that Delenn had become a bit 
chunkier than usual <g>.

Kosh's greeting sounded like "Entil Zha Valen." Is that correct?


 #: 13423 S2/Bab 5: General
    05-Jan-98  23:48:03
Sb: #13302-#ItB and The Gathering
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      That was his interior monologue, yes.

                                                                    jms

 [ Summary: Asks what the Dilgar War, mentioned in "In the Beginning," 
   was all about. ]

 #: 13523 S4/Seas. 1-4 SPOILERS
    06-Jan-98  15:47:10
Sb: #13442-<<ItB: Dilgar War ? >>
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      There's a fair amount about the Dilgar in "Deathwalker," first season. 
And thanks.

                                                                    jms

 [ Summary: Asks what the heck the "Zoo Scene" in the pilot was all about. ]

 #: 13420 S4/Seas. 1-4 SPOILERS
    05-Jan-98  23:48:03
Sb: #<TG> Zoo Scene
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      The idea was just to go through the sector, pass some aliens, see the 
exteriors of some quarters...the director made it into a zoo.

                                                                    jms


 [ Summary: A Marcus fan asks if the alien healing machine can revive
   a dead person. ]

 #: 13524 S4/Seas. 1-4 SPOILERS
    06-Jan-98  15:47:10
Sb: #13469-#Marcus....why
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      Thanks...as for the alien machine, no, it definitely won't work on a 
dead person.


                                                                    jms


 [ Summary: "My wife and I sat there and watched this show, and were 
   brought to tears toward the end." ]

 #: 13525 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    06-Jan-98  15:47:11
Sb: #13054-#In the Beginning
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      Thanks...it's a very moving and emotional movie in a lot of places, 
which was the goal.  If it doesn't touch you, there ain't much point to doing 
it.

                                                                    jms


 #: 13513 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    06-Jan-98  15:43:12
Sb: #13060-#<<ItB - Zowie!>>
Fm: PHILIP HORNSEY

Joe,

The only way that ItB could have been better is if it were longer. It almost 
had the quality of one of those great old WWII movies where they spend some 
time intro'ing the characters and then kill them off one by one until only two 
or three are left. Pity you didn't have another hour or so to show Sinclair 
hanging out with Mitchell or Franklin rejoing EF.

You also cleared up a couple of questions.

1)  You *completely sold* Clark's takeover. In the aftermath of that, I would 
have given the SOB the benifit of the doubt (for at least 72 hours) when he 
declared martial law. You have already shown Earth as being crazy for new 
technology, but after this my only comment is that you've undersold that 
aspect of EarthGov. 

Hell yes they'd treat with the Shadows. After the E-M War, if I were 
president, I'd sell my soul for military technology, so that that could *never 
happen again*.

2) The above takes care of my only other nit, which was that EarthGov let Mars 
go. Prior to the Clark Administration, there were entrenched interests of the 
sort that do not change with the changing of the goverment (Krupp was happy 
under German democracy, Nazism, etc.).

Now I understand. EarthGov traded Mars for electrogravitic technology. That 
one advance (added to the semi-organics learned from the Shadows) puts the 
humans at parity with the Minbari in one generation, and is a hundred times 
more important, because it guarantees a fighting chance in any war.

3) Human xenophobia is basically justified by this ep. One might have argued 
that given that racism and the like are basically gone, xenophobia would never 
have gotten started. Not after the E-M War.

As to the movie itself.

This was probably the best fiction I have ever seen on television. The scenes 
of the war itself were terribly beautiful, the score was haunting, and Londo's 
narration was simply *perfect*.

I nearly cried when the President asked the military to "hold the line" so 
that a pitiful few hundred could escape. In that single moment, you feel that 
even if the Minbari had done it, those few refugees would have sired a people 
who, eventually, would have made it. Just at that moment, you see the echo to 
the ball of light flying into the encounter suit a million years hence.

Finally, I find it ironic that the only person in the whole series who seems 
to totally comprehend humanity is Londo.

I always have felt this show is about him.

Phil^^^^
FREE MARS!



 #: 13532 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    06-Jan-98  16:14:08
Sb: #13513-#<<ItB - Zowie!>>
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

"I nearly cried when the President asked the military to "hold the line" so 
that a pitiful few hundred could escape. In that single moment, you feel that 
even if the Minbari had done it, those few refugees would have sired a people 
who, eventually, would have made it. Just at that moment, you see the echo to 
the ball of light flying into the encounter suit a million years hence."

      It's a very moving scene, even for me.  There's something in particular 
about a female president making that request, and giving those orders, that is 
especially strong.  I don't know why that should be, but somehow it is. We as 
a people tend to forget our own strength, and as Londo says, our stubborn 
nobility.  We only seem to remember it when we stand on the edge of the abyss, 
when it's almost too late to do anything about it.

"I always have felt this show is about him."

      Yeah, in many ways, it is.

                                                                    jms


 [ Summary: "I noticed at around the 15 minute mark, there was a fade 
   out / fade in, like a commercial was supposed to go there.  Was 
   that supposed to be a scene fade?" ]

 #: 13426 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    05-Jan-98  23:48:04
Sb: #13250-<<ItB - Zowie!>>
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      Yeah, there was supposed to be a commercial there, but instead TNT ran 
straight through into act 2, and inserted a commercial in act 6, right before 
they go to see Sinclair.

                                                                    jms


 #: 13116 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    05-Jan-98  06:54:12
Sb: <<In the Beginning>>
Fm: STEVEN K. ANDEWEG

Amazing how I keep getting fooled into thinking you and B5 can never surmount 
your latest level of quality in episodes like" Endgame" and "Deconstruction of 
Stars" in terms of story and production.  Then you go out there, notch up the 
bar a few more inches, and go flying over with" In the Beginning".  Great 
story, superb acting and special effects, an overall beautiful production!

Steve A.

 #: 13526 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    06-Jan-98  15:47:11
Sb: #13116-#<<In the Beginning>>
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      And the thing is..."In the Beginning" cost us a tick under $3 million 
bucks, which is almost nil in terms of budgets for TV movies.  It looks like 
it's a $12 million feature film.

                                                                    jms


 #: 13315 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    05-Jan-98  19:40:14
Sb: #13247-<ITB> thoughts
Fm: MARTIN ROTH

>> I'm wondering if it was a glitch, irrelevant, or he's considering Adira one 
 . . <<

I'd bet against any of these options. It's Joe writing this, remember... <g>

It's probably a hint about something we haven't seen yet. Or something we 
*have* seen but have forgotten about.


-- Marty     PPG


 #: 13430 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    06-Jan-98  02:03:13
Sb: #13315-<ITB> thoughts
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      No, it's been established that Londo's first wife was a dancer, who he 
was forced to divorce by his family.

                                                                    jms


 #: 13173 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    05-Jan-98  10:15:04
Sb: <ITB> thoughts
Fm: MARTIN ROTH

Wow.

I expected to be impressed. I was not disappointed. Joe, you've outdone 
yourself again.



Some random, disorganized thoughts, comments, and observations, in no 
particular order:

Londo is full of regret and has loaded himself down with tremendous guilt -- 
probably even more than he really deserves. For example, the "peace mission" 
that he unwittingly disrupted appeared to only be an outside shot in any case. 
It's doubtful that anything short of Sinclair's encounter with the triluminary 
would've convinced the Minbari to stop at that point. Yet Londo seems now to 
blame himself for the entire war anyway. Quite a change from the Londo we saw 
at the beginning. And definitely an extrapolation of what we've seen happening 
to him lately.

Londo's "What do you want?" ... "He did a lot better with that question than I 
did." A nice piece of retroactive foreshadowing for the new viewers.

We get to see Delenn develop duing the course of the movie from a timid, 
uncertain follower of Dukhat into a strong, decisive leader. She still doesn't 
seem totally confident in herself or what she's doing, but she has learned to 
hide her doubts. And she has learned to manipulate.

Despite the hints, it was still a surprise to actually see the Vorlons appear 
in Dukhat's sanctum.  It was also interesting to note that when Delenn asked 
their names, Kosh responded and the other (Ulkesh?) did not.

I wonder what would've happened if Sheridan had accepted the assignment to the 
Prometheus. Is it possible he would've been firmer with the Captain about the 
orders to avoid contact they had received, and that the entire incident and 
thus the war might've been avoided?

The footage used from various series episodes -- Sinclair from "Sky Full of 
Stars", Delenn and the Minbari from "Atonement", Michael York on the 
Prometheus from "Avalon" -- was a nice touch. For those of us who have seen 
the episodes, it's a good tie-in to what we already had seen, giving the 
episodes a fuller context; for those who have not seen the episodes yet, it 
just blended into the story naturally.

At what age do Centauri boys have their hair start to stick up?

The Earth generals mention that the Minbari are skipping the civilian targets 
and concentrating on the military in keeping with their caste system. They 
then state that the Minbari will go back and kill the civilians later. How do 
they know this? Do they have additional information they're not mentioning 
about Minbari war strategy? Are they just guessing? Or are they just making it 
all up as propaganda, thinking that it will motivate the Earth Forces to fight 
harder?

There was one point in Delenn's quarters where I was *sure* that Lenonn was 
about to say "All we are saying is give peace a chance!" <g>

Londo had *four* wives -- so there's one we haven't seen (yet).  And he says 
he "cared for them all deeply"!  OK...

Some of the meetings between the characters seemed *a little* contrived, but 
I'm fine with attributing it to dramatic license. It's the only real "problem" 
I had with the story, and as these things go it's certainly not a significant 
one. 


-- Marty     PPG

 #: 13527 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    06-Jan-98  15:47:12
Sb: #13173-#<ITB> thoughts
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      Londo's first wife was a dancer, who he was forced to divorce by his 
family.

      Adira reminds him of her a lot.

                                                                    jms


 #: 13357 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    05-Jan-98  21:11:11
Sb: #13341-#<ITB> thoughts
Fm: MARTIN ROTH

>> In "The War Prayer" he says he has three wives, all of them arranged 
marriages. <<

And these are the three we see in "Soul Mates"

>> In "A Voice in the Wilderness" Londo tells Garibaldi about a dancer he fell 
in love with and married immediately.  Joe said that was a fourth wife whom he 
had to divorce, although that story hasn't come up in the show. <<

You're absolutely right. I had forgotten about that. Thanks.

But that still doesn't explain the "cared for them all deeply" part in 
relation to the other three... <bg>


 #: 13533 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    06-Jan-98  16:14:08
Sb: #13357-#<ITB> thoughts
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

"But that still doesn't explain the "cared for them all deeply" part in 
relation to the other three... <bg>"

      We remember what, and how, we choose to remember.

                                                                    jms


 [ Summary: "Congratulations, to you, and all your team." ]

 #: 13424 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    05-Jan-98  23:48:04
Sb: #13223-In the Beginning
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      Thanks, it's been a real struggle, and we've had to overcome a lot to 
get to this point.

                                                                    jms

 [ Summary: "Last night was a fabulous inaugural for Babylon 5 move to 
   TNT." ]

 #: 13425 S5/Seas. 5 SPOILERS
    05-Jan-98  23:48:04
Sb: #13254-In the Beginning
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI

      Thanks.

                                                                    jms


[END]

-***
-*** B5JMS SUBSCRIBERS: Replies to messages go to the list maintainer,
-*** <b5jms-owner at cs.columbia.edu>.  If you want to reply elsewhere, adjust
-*** the "To" field.  See http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~ezk/b5jms/ for all
-*** other information about this list.



More information about the B5JMS mailing list