JMS on CompuServe (May 13, 1996) *POSSIBLE SPOILERS* 2/3
Brent Barrett
bbarrett at speedlink.com
Mon May 13 16:14:05 EDT 1996
[ Continued from previous section -- BB ]
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WARNING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The following posts may contain SPOILERS for
upcoming Babylon 5 episodes.
Continue at your own risk.
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THE FOLLOWING MATERIAL IS THE COPYRIGHT OF THE
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Note that JMS has expressed his public permission
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I give permission for my summaries to be reposted in
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[ Summary of subjects in this section: ]
Sb: #504192-#<I&E>
Sb: #504488-Joe an atheist?
Sb: #504453-UK Titles
Sb: #504495-Radio & TV Museum
Sb: #504468-#<Ship of Tears>
Sb: #504431->>Interludes<<
Sb: #504407-#Cheers for Mira
Sb: #504409-<Interludes - Name>
Sb: #504405-<What have you DONE???>
Sb: #504525-#<I&E, "wow" part II>
Sb: #504633-#Joe an atheist?
#: 504192 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
12-May-96 08:12:49
Sb: #<I&E>
Fm: PHILIP HORNSEY
Joe,
Just wanted to drop you a line about I&E. For some time now I have been waiting
for an ep that was the equal of Coming of Shadows for pacing, attention to
detail, as well as style and all the ineffible qualities, this one is finally
it. Don't get me wrong, the eps this year have been great, but there have
always been one or two *little* *tiny* things that break the illusion.
In the threesome earlier, something about the battle with the shadow vessel
over Jupiter didn't work *just right* for me (I don't even know what that thing
was). Later, the battle over B5 hat *tiny* little flaws, (the Alexander shaking
after a kit to the Churchill, Sheridan calling the Agrippa, the Roanoak, etc.)
All these things are *so trivial* that I have barely mentioned them until now.
I&E was *seamless*. From the time it started to the time it ended, it was just
*seamless*. Londo, Kosh, the words with Sheridan, Kosh admitting fear on the
edge of death (and the fact that he was so selfless when *dying* as to think of
Sheridan). In one fell swoop, I now have to reappraise the Vorlon, decide if I
am going to root for Londo (probably so, I wanna see Refa get creamed), and
morn for a character who came into sharp relief *only when he died*!
I never understood a centilla of Kosh until now, in one instance you revealed
pride, stoacism, fear, and friendship. In the end he wasn't a cynical
manipulator, but seemed simply flawed, and more "human".
Which probably means he *was* a cynical manipulator...
i hate you...
Phil ^^^^
FREE EARTH!
#: 504539 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
12-May-96 19:02:30
Sb: #504192-#<I&E>
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
"I hate you."
Why, thank you...then the episode had its desired effect....
jms
#: 504488 S5/Babylon 5: General
12-May-96 17:42:42
Sb: #504377-#Joe an atheist?
Fm: DANIEL M. UPTON
At what point does anything you said address my point that a standard that
isn't divine must therefore be human? "Rights" to a conservative/libertarian
are immunities, to a liberal they are entitlements but in neither case to they
spring forth from the individual alone. Otherwise what stops me from decreeing
that I have a "right" to everything you own and backing up that claim with the
fact that I am better armed than you? Rights must be granted by some force
greater than the individual. That leaves God or the state.
Dan^^^^
danupton at blueridge.net
#: 504720 S5/Babylon 5: General
13-May-96 00:04:40
Sb: #504488-Joe an atheist?
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
"Otherwise what stops me from decreeing that I have a "right" to everything you
own and backing up that claim with the fact that I am better armed than you?
Rights must be granted by some force greater than the individual. That leaves
God or the state."
And, of course, this is exactly what happened on a regular basis throughout
human history until only the last couple of centuries.
If it was god doing this granting of rights...where was he for the last six
thousand years? Snoozing off in a corner somewhere?
No, the rights you speak of were won by humans, fighting for their right not to
be trammeled upon by greater forces, and bonding together in common cause to
make sure it doesn't happen again in this place.
While many of the "founding fathers" were believers, many others were simply
deists, or freethinkers...they didn't do what they did because suddenly they
figured god had given them the right, but because they got pushed to the wall,
and we were 3000 nautical miles away from King George, and they in their very
human way got fed up with being pushed around and decided it was time to push
back, and create a set of laws that would prevent the tyrant from trying it
again, or rising from within.
Sorry, Daniel, we did this on our own. God's a credit jumper.
jms
[ Summary: A U.K. viewer notes that the titles and credits in the U.K.
version of the episodes are different than the U.S. version. ]
#: 504721 S5/Babylon 5: General
13-May-96 00:04:43
Sb: #504453-UK Titles
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
I suspect that this is because we provide textless sections in the
beginning to foreign markets for various languages, so they set them in a
different type. I guess....
jms
#: 504495 S5/Babylon 5: General
12-May-96 18:05:09
Sb: #Radio & TV Museum
Fm: SYSOP LEE WHITESIDE
Joe, I stopped into the Museum of Radio and Television earlier this week in
L.A. and did a search on Science Fiction to see what all they had available.
Lots of Star Trek and Twilight Zones and various other things including a few
Doctor Who's. Do they only include things that they get as part of a festival
or something or can some producer or studio offer them some tapes to make
available for viewing? I'd think that if they had the Babylon 5 pilot or some
of the first season episodes, a lot of people might visit them just for those.
I was glad to see that they do have tapes of their festival programs (where
they have the cast and creators of a show) and looked at the MST3K and X-Files
presentations.
Hopefully, someone can convince them that Babylon 5 is worthy of being part of
the festival in the near future. I'd certainly fly or drive out for that. My
wife and I attended the Lois and Clark one a couple of years ago and really
enjoyed it.
#: 504722 S5/Babylon 5: General
13-May-96 00:04:44
Sb: #504495-Radio & TV Museum
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
I hadn't even thought about that aspect...it's certainly one that should
be pursued, I agree.
jms
#: 504468 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
12-May-96 16:25:59
Sb: #501911-#<Ship of Tears>
Fm: SHANE S. SHELLENBARGER
Joe,
I was at a dinner party last night and SHIP OF TEARS came up as a topic.
Generally, good things were said, but one of the group commented the episode
made them think that of Captain Eo vs.The Borg. While I'm sure that you never
intended the comparison when you wrote SoT, (I'd go so far as to lay odds that
you've never seen Captain Eo), were the parallels mentioned by anyone when the
show was being produced?
Shane
#: 504723 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
13-May-96 00:04:48
Sb: #504468-#<Ship of Tears>
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
No, it's never come up before, and I think that's WAY stretching it. (How
come everybody always spends so much time trying to find out what a show like
B5 is *like* instead of just looking at it for what it is? "Oh, it's Cap'n
Eo...oh, no, it's Lord of the Rings...Dune, Dune, I tell you, it's Dune...no,
it's this over here...no, it's Cap'n Crunch...."
Feh.
jms
[ Summary: Wonders if B5 has a lot more directors than other shows. ]
#: 504724 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
13-May-96 00:04:49
Sb: #504431->>Interludes<<
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
Actually, no, there are probably fewer. We have a stable of about half a
dozen directors at any given time; some move on, some stay, it's the nature of
the beast. That's about par for the course, maybe a bit less. I know we had
more on Murder, She Wrote.
jms
#: 504407 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
12-May-96 14:20:29
Sb: #501910-#Cheers for Mira
Fm: THE JAWA / JAWA #2
I noticed that Mr. Boxleitner's acting is VERY, VERY good in the scene
where he's telling off Kosh ("I&E").
Sinclair's coming back next week, and you know what?
Now I couldn't tell you which I prefer (and I am a die-hard Sinclair
fan--about to become a die-hard Sheridan fan too).
The Jawa
Kidism Patrol
In Memory of....KOSH???!
#: 504725 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
13-May-96 00:04:52
Sb: #504407-#Cheers for Mira
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
Which is pretty much what I told you would be the case by this point.
(Nobody ever believes me...do I have an untrustworthy face? Do I look like
Robert Vesco trying to sneak back into the country disguised as Moe Howard?)
And yes, Bruce is a hell of a lot better than some folks were willing to
give him credit for in the beginning. I think that's coming out now as his
role becomes more deep and more serious.
jms
#: 504409 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
12-May-96 14:23:21
Sb: #504065-#<Interludes - Name>
Fm: ELYSE M. GRASSO
Joe --
A possibly silly quaestion related to the Shadows...
Are they a lot bigger now? Morden's buddies, I mean. It seems to me that when
we've seen them in the past (In the Shadow of Za'Ha'Dum, for example) they
looked sort of table height, and this time they were at least shoulder height.
Hmm... I'll have to go back and check my tapes, but if my memory is correct,
Winkin, Blinkin and Nod were even smaller the first time we saw them than they
were in ITSoZ.
How big do they grow?
(I know... wait and see <g>).
#: 504726 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
13-May-96 00:04:55
Sb: #504409-<Interludes - Name>
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
No, they're about the same height consistently; it's probably an artifact
of the camera angles and lighting.
jms
#: 504405 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
12-May-96 14:17:27
Sb: #<What have you DONE???>
Fm: THE JAWA / JAWA #2
JOE!
You should WARN people when you're about to do things to Kosh!
I spit out my coffee when I saw the remains on Sheridan's desk!
At least put warning labels in the TVG....geez Louise...
(I liked it.
I think.
I feel like somebody punched me in the stomach--which you, as the
sadistic writer, are probably glad to hear.)
I'm really afraid to ask, but....
I saw a story in the TV Page saying that renewal is up in the air.
Now, I haven't been browsing (my parents limit my typing these days),
but how are things...going?
If worst comes to worst, can TNT pick up the whole show?
(I never realized how *real* this show is....man, Kosh is *gone*....)
The Jawa
Kidism Patrol
In Memory of....KOSH???!
#: 504727 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
13-May-96 00:04:56
Sb: #504405-<What have you DONE???>
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
If we put in warnings, the impact would be reduced.
No word yet on renewal, probably in the next couple of weeks we'll hear
something definitive.
jms
[ Summary: A long, detailed and well written analysis of "Interludes &
Examinations." ]
#: 504728 S6/Babylon 5: Upcoming
13-May-96 00:04:59
Sb: #504525-#<I&E, "wow" part II>
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
"The "arc" is fully alive for you now, I think. Without these characters
living and breathing inside your mind I don't see how one man could write as
much as you have over the past two seasons. What I *have* noticed is that all
the actors now seem to be responding to the story you're telling."
Yeah, it's kind of a funny thing...the deeper we got into the season, as the
actors saw only one name on script after script, and they began to understand
what was coming, and it's all *very* consistent...the sense of this being a
novel really came through for everyone in a very profound way. You could
really feel a change in everyone's attitude, though it'd be hard to put into
words. A sense of, "This is it, this is the story, we're moving now, we're
doing something nobody's ever done." They know how hard it is for anyone to
write this many scripts, which is why it's never been done before, and I think
they not only respected that, but felt they had to rise to the challenge and
give just as much at that end of it. Usually you tend to hit a slump
energy-wise in your third year; not here. Everyone's just hitting all
cylinders.
jms
#: 504633 S5/Babylon 5: General
12-May-96 20:57:50
Sb: #504533-#Joe an atheist?
Fm: DANIEL M. UPTON
>> For a long time, the church had no problem with the concept of slavery.
Even used sections of the bible as proof that it was a proper activity. Only
later, after society began to change, did they come around. Why? Because they
reacted to changing human opinions. Once, the proper way to deal with heretics
was to burn them at the stake, or press them with stones. That changed as
society changed.<<
You are correct to point out that the abolitionists were not acting on a true
biblical mandate. This is not to say that they should not have wanted to end
the institution of slavery, only that the desire did not spring from a biblical
command that slavery was categorically evil. The bible is not the kind of rule
book in which everything not forbidden is compelled, just because slavery was
allowed did not mean it was commanded. Humans are given wide latitude in
designing governments for themselves and the only test He applies to them is
that they protect life. It would also be proper to point out that the American
founders were acting against biblical commands in rebelling against the lawful
authority of the British crown. None of this *none of it* negates the two
points that I have made. One, that since science cannot address the question
of the existence of God it is not proper to talk about "knowing" if he exists
in the same sense that we can "know" that the sun is shining when we are
standing under it on a cloudless day. The second is that without a
transcendent standard of morality that *any* other standard *must* be based on
subjective human opinion.
You have spent this entire discussion acting like I am trying to force
something down your throat that you do not want to accept. I have not. The
closest thing to an insulting term that I have used is to call human opinion
"fickle" but if that isn't a proper term for the race that produced both Mother
Teresa *and* Adolph Hitler, George Washington *and* Bill Clinton, Babylon 5
*and* Star Trek: Voyager then what is?
Dan^^^^
danupton at blueridge.net
#: 504731 S5/Babylon 5: General
13-May-96 00:22:03
Sb: #504633-#Joe an atheist?
Fm: J. MICHAEL STRACZYNSKI
Dan, I know you don't understand how one could take offense at some of
this, which is why I've more or less been riding closely on my reactions. Let
me try and explain:
Your statement is that without a "transcendental" outside force, a deity,
to tell us right from wrong, that we have no way of distinguishing good from
evil, Mother Theresa from Hitler. That's what you *said*. Now, I don't buy
into the deity business. Therefore, *by your definition*, I'm one of those
folks who can't distinguish a humanitarian from a mass murderer.
The problem, Daniel, is that there's so much jingoism in this argument
that statements like the one you made are put out there almost reflexively,
without thinking.
jms
[ Continued in next section -- BB ]
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