ATTN: JMS Stealing scenes from other works

[B5JMS Poster]

Subject: ATTN: JMS Stealing scenes from other works
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 No. | DATE        |  FROM
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s  1: Nov 13, 1996: Michael Knight <michael at espcomp.com>
+  3: Nov 13, 1996: "Jeffrey A. Morris" <morris.104 at postbox.acs.ohio-state.edu>
*  4: Nov 13, 1996: jmsatb5 at aol.com

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From: Michael Knight <michael at espcomp.com>
Lines: 34

Sorry for the flagrant header . . . wanted to catch your attention.

I've heard in the past muttering and sometimes sharps attacks that as a
writer you borrow heavily from other sources.  And often you bristle at the
charges that your works are not original.  Among many charges are that you
"steal" from The Prisoner, Lord of the Rings, Dune, and whatever the
self-imposed critic has read recently.  Someone brought up innocently enough
the comparision of Sheridan's jump at Z'ha'dum and Gandolfs fall into the
abyss at Khazad-dum.  Obviously this is to close a coincidence to write off.
And I think it is right on target.

Now obviously your works have their origins in the hero story and the epic
myth and I will not and can not argue their influences in your work.  But
the LotR reference is obvious.  That does NOT imply stealing.  

If you want us to compare Gandolf's plunge which changed him from grey to
white to Sheridan's jump, I believe that is intentional.  Is Sheridan going
from grey to white, or white to grey.  That mere connection forces the
readers to attempt to draw that comparison and give the action more depth
and richness.

My guess is the same critic would say Milton's work on Paradise Lost is crap
because he stole it from the bible (not to say you are Milton . . . yet).

As a final note, I just want to say in behalf of many great artist before
today, it is not STEALING, it's called classical reference!

--
MJK   was MNMNK at AOL.com
"You are finite, Zatharas is finite, this . . . is wrong tool"





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From: "Jeffrey A. Morris" <morris.104 at postbox.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Lines: 47

In article <199611130605.XAA28874 at smtp.espcomp.com>, Michael Knight
<michael at espcomp.com> says:
>Someone brought up innocently enough
>the comparision of Sheridan's jump at Z'ha'dum and Gandolfs fall into the
>abyss at Khazad-dum.  Obviously this is to close a coincidence to write off.
>And I think it is right on target.

Actually, it's more like Luke Skywalker falling down the airshaft in
Cloud City after Vader tried to turn him to the dark side... 

"..we can rule the galaxy together, as father and son..."
;;>
Neely

* Response from JMS: But the thing is, I wasn't *thinking* of LoTR...I
was thinking of Orpheus
* going into the underworld, of the classical notion of descending into
hell
* to find oneself or something else...it just bugs me when someone
assumes
* that they know what was in my head at a time when I wrote something,
and
* then take that as a given and start making me explain it or acting as
if
* this is true, when it ain't.

	* jms


	I think both posters above, as well as many more who post "That's from
..." messages after each episode, should read JMS' book on
scriptwriting. There are some enlightening discussions of the difference
between an idea and the *execution* of that idea. Yes, the fall is
reminiscent of scenes from many different stories (told by different
cultures over the past few thousand years). But it is what led up to the
fall, all the background on character, situation, etc, that gives the
scene its context and meaning and produces an emotional response from
the viewer. It is this, and not the idea of a hero falling into an abyss
to undertake a transformative journey, that makes the episode (and the
show) a *story,* and not just a *concept.* All that takes skill, hard
work and untold hours of gut-wrenching stress (Hollywood is a tough
town, from what I hear). That is what JMS gets paid for. It's what we
expect for the time we take to watch the show. And it's what is
delivered on a 22 episode-per-year basis. The only thing you can
legitimately accuse JMS of stealing from is the human collective
unconscious. But we all do that, now don't we?


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From: jmsatb5 at aol.com
Lines: 13

But the thing is, I wasn't *thinking* of LoTR...I was thinking of Orpheus
going into the underworld, of the classical notion of descending into hell
to find oneself or something else...it just bugs me when someone assumes
that they know what was in my head at a time when I wrote something, and
then take that as a given and start making me explain it or acting as if
this is true, when it ain't.


 jms




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